Bartuc socketing advice requested.

[ArtDent]

What should I stick in the single socket Larzuk put in my Bartuc's claw?
Some high %ED jewel? Other? I use traps and BF, so faster attack rate is
not needed.
And...
Is there a cube recipe to give me more sockets in my second one?

[john graesser]

Post by ArtDent
What should I stick in the single socket Larzuk put in my Bartuc's claw?
Some high %ED jewel? Other? I use traps and BF, so faster attack rate is
not needed.
And...
Is there a cube recipe to give me more sockets in my second one?

Resist jewels or mf jewels are popular. Uniques will only get one socket
when punched.

[John]

Post by john graesser

Post by ArtDent
What should I stick in the single socket Larzuk put in my Bartuc's claw?
Some high %ED jewel? Other? I use traps and BF, so faster attack rate is
not needed.
And...
Is there a cube recipe to give me more sockets in my second one?

Resist jewels or mf jewels are popular. Uniques will only get one socket
when punched.

Even just one socket on a good unique can make it even better. I
usually hold those socket rewards till I really need them, or till I
find just the right item to socket and with the right rune/jewel.
i.e. stick a cold rainbow facet into each of items (3 or 4 depending on
if you use a shield) and you get (3) 72/117 cold w/ 9-15% cold skill
damage and minus 9-15 enemy cold resist helps too. Or throw an extra
IAS jewel somewhere to get you to the next speed breakpoint.

[Shiflet]

Even just one socket on a good unique can make it even better. I usually
hold those socket rewards till I really need them

I don't, I spend them like crazy. Mainly cause it takes 10-15 minutes to get
one, just create a char, hop on a "normal rush" train, get to act 5 and have
someone kill Shenk(many normal rushers will do it freely), and voila, socket
quest. Socket your item, delete character, then do it again next time you
need another socket reward. Every character I have has every socketable
piece of equipment they have socketed with something or other.

[Patrick Vervoorn]

Post by ArtDent
What should I stick in the single socket Larzuk put in my Bartuc's claw?
Some high %ED jewel? Other? I use traps and BF, so faster attack rate is
not needed.

Actually, I'm not sure Bartuc's is the best choice for this build...? Why
did you choose to use Bartuc's? What do you have in your other hand?

Post by ArtDent
Is there a cube recipe to give me more sockets in my second one?

No. Unique items, which can get sockets (Throwing weapons, for instance,
cannot) get 1 from Larzuk, and the route via Larzuk is the only way to
punch a hole in them.

Regards,

Patrick.

[ArtDent]

On 3-Sep-2006, Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Actually, I'm not sure Bartuc's is the best choice for this build...? Why
did you choose to use Bartuc's?

For the plus to skills. And it's damage was more than any other claw type
weapon with assasin skills that I have seen yet.

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
What do you have in your other hand?

A second Bartuc's.

[Patrick Vervoorn]

Post by ArtDent
On 3-Sep-2006, Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Actually, I'm not sure Bartuc's is the best choice for this build...? Why
did you choose to use Bartuc's?

For the plus to skills. And it's damage was more than any other claw type
weapon with assasin skills that I have seen yet.

Hmmm, I have quite a bit of experience with pure trappers and while
Bartuc's is a nice stop-gap, I'd rather use magical or rare claws with
either +2 assa or +3 traps and +x to certain traps mods, together with
IAS, and some stats.

Blade Fury, on the other hand, I have a bit less experience with, but I
thought this skill thrived off a healthy dose of Crushing Blow? None of
that is on Bartuc's...

Post by ArtDent

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
What do you have in your other hand?

A second Bartuc's.

Hmm, ok. Again, little experience with Blade Fury, but I'd perhaps be on
the lookout for a nice rare claw with +2 assa skills, loads of ed
(Cruel+Grandmaster's on it) and perhaps some +bonuses to useful skills.
Will be quite expensive though. ;)

What've you got on the weapon switch? Depending on how your secondary slot
is filled, an alternative could be to put a traps-oriented setup in the
first weapon slot, and a Blade Fury-oriented setup in the secondary slot?

Regards,

Patrick.

[Virtual Den]

Post by Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Hmmm, I have quite a bit of experience with pure trappers and while

Bartuc's is a nice stop-gap, I'd rather use magical or rare claws with
either +2 assa or +3 traps and +x to certain traps mods, together with
IAS, and some stats.

I would too if I could spend enough time shopping but these weapons
which are so hard to shop, I mean with the extra useful mods.. Bartuc
is so easier to get and it is already fast but if he does not use Fire
Bomb the speed of the weapon is less important IMO for LS and DS even
if I like the way I can set up these traps faster..

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Blade Fury, on the other hand, I have a bit less experience with, but I
thought this skill thrived off a healthy dose of Crushing Blow? None of
that is on Bartuc's...

I do not have experience with the BF skill but I considered it once,
when I saw someone using it because it looked so cool. I read in a
forum that this skill sucks so may be a good way to use it would be to
get some Crushing Blow as you suggested. Then you need to hit the
target so even if the Bartuc has a bonus to attack rating and with the
dex, would it be enough without the mastery, I think not. I would
rather think that BF could be a good one point skill if it was used
with some CB and a lot of Mastery.

Post by Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
What do you have in your other hand?

A second Bartuc's.

Hmm, ok. Again, little experience with Blade Fury, but I'd perhaps be on
the lookout for a nice rare claw with +2 assa skills, loads of ed
(Cruel+Grandmaster's on it) and perhaps some +bonuses to useful skills.
Will be quite expensive though. ;)

OMG stop dreaming about the claw(s) needed!!! ;oP I have no xp in the
BF skill but I never considered using CB when I read this forum saying
this skill suck. Could BF be efficient with CB items even if they would
weaken the efficiency of the other traps but I think it can be very
playable .

One point in BF then boost the mastery and ........obviously the main
traps will be weaker but once there are two or three bodies, DS can
take care of them.I never boosted my attack rating with Dex but Two
Bartuc are not so bad afterall with 40 dex and the attack rating bonus.


I want to point out I replied to Patrick because he had many good
points but my replies are also pointed out to Artdent and some
precisions about the skills he is planning to use would be welcome. I
really think it could work and it would be great.!!! hey I ever saw two
or three of BF Asn.

VD

[ArtDent]

Post by Virtual Den
One point in BF

Yep, one point wonder, 3/4 of your weapon damage does make me think I will
eventually be using some other weapon(s), but doing ok with the dual
Bartucs so far.

Post by Virtual Den
then boost the mastery

Claw mastery? I thought that was pretty much a one point wonder also.
Just to get weapon block.

Post by Virtual Den
and ........obviously the main
traps will be weaker but once there are two or three bodies, DS can
take care of them.I never boosted my attack rating with Dex but Two
Bartuc are not so bad afterall with 40 dex and the attack rating bonus.
I want to point out I replied to Patrick because he had many good
points but my replies are also pointed out to Artdent and some
precisions about the skills he is planning to use would be welcome. I
really think it could work and it would be great.!!! hey I ever saw two
or three of BF Asn.

She is mainly a trapsin, got LS and DS maxed, working on synergies for
boosting the LS, which has top damage of about 3300 or so so far.
I use the BF for the lightning immunes mostly, I crafted myself a fairly
nice pair of gloves with knockback, which works oh so nice with the BF,
then I got about 5 or 6 cold dmg sc's to freeze 'em too, keeps them slow
and away from me, heh. Plus, the BF gets me my life leech for the times I
do get hit from some ranged attack or something.
The level 10 firestorm is not to be sneezed at also from her torch,
doesn't do a lot, but every little bit adds up.
Not a lot of points coming anymore, she is 85 already, with none in
reserve, I did 'squander' a few (5 or 6) here and there in the MA tree
that I never ever use.
But anyway, back to my original question, even if I don't keep using them,
what would give the most damage help in a socket in the Bartucs?
A facet like was suggested? I did just get two from Dan's housecleaning.
:D

[Patrick Vervoorn]

Post by ArtDent

Post by Virtual Den
One point in BF

Yep, one point wonder, 3/4 of your weapon damage does make me think I will
eventually be using some other weapon(s), but doing ok with the dual
Bartucs so far.

Yup. But see my reply to VD: I'm not sure the two Bartuc's will provide 2
x the %to Ar bonus.

Post by ArtDent

Post by Virtual Den
then boost the mastery

Claw mastery? I thought that was pretty much a one point wonder also.
Just to get weapon block.

See the description of the Blade Fury skill on the AS: Claw mastery boosts
the damage your claws does, and that means that the number used for the
3/4 calculation, becomes higher. I think you can fill in the blanks from
here yourself... ;)

Post by ArtDent
She is mainly a trapsin, got LS and DS maxed, working on synergies for
boosting the LS, which has top damage of about 3300 or so so far.
I use the BF for the lightning immunes mostly, I crafted myself a fairly
nice pair of gloves with knockback, which works oh so nice with the BF,
then I got about 5 or 6 cold dmg sc's to freeze 'em too, keeps them slow
and away from me, heh. Plus, the BF gets me my life leech for the times I
do get hit from some ranged attack or something.

Most trappers use Fire Blast for the LI immunes, since it also nicely
synergizes with, and is synergized by, the lightning traps. Mine does
about 3500-4500 damage.

Post by ArtDent
The level 10 firestorm is not to be sneezed at also from her torch,
doesn't do a lot, but every little bit adds up.
Not a lot of points coming anymore, she is 85 already, with none in
reserve, I did 'squander' a few (5 or 6) here and there in the MA tree
that I never ever use.
But anyway, back to my original question, even if I don't keep using them,
what would give the most damage help in a socket in the Bartucs?
A facet like was suggested? I did just get two from Dan's housecleaning.

Facet? If you're talking about lightning facets, these do not boost the
lightning traps' damage, since traps are considered minions. A Fire Facet
would work with Fire Blase (but not with the 2 traps: again minions).

Otherwise, I don't know what facet you'd socket in?

If you lack res, how about a rare with res-all, and some ED? Otherwise
perhaps a nice ed jewel could further boost the 3/4 base damage...

Regards,

Patrick.

[ArtDent]

On 4-Sep-2006, Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Most trappers use Fire Blast for the LI immunes, since it also nicely
synergizes with, and is synergized by, the lightning traps. Mine does
about 3500-4500 damage.

I do have that up to about 4000 top damage I think, had to pump it to get
DS to shoot more times, but I find the BF to be 'easier' for me since I
keep it set up on the left button, all I have to do is press shift and I
can shoot them out, my spell hot keys for the right button are the 'F'
keys on top and it takes longer to move my hand to get to them (since my
left hand sits with fingers over shift/ctrl and alt for shooting/running
and 'looking'). Besides, with the knockback, I think it is 'safer', the
FB takes more time in the air, and is easier to miss, I can 'machine gun'
the BF, almost seems to hit more often if I 'aim' in front of the monsters
and spray a bit, rather than 'highlighting' one and then another monster.
And on top of all that, it is somehow just more 'satisifying' to my
twisted brain. :D

[Patrick Vervoorn]

Post by ArtDent
On 4-Sep-2006, Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Most trappers use Fire Blast for the LI immunes, since it also nicely
synergizes with, and is synergized by, the lightning traps. Mine does
about 3500-4500 damage.

All of my comments below are based on things I read about Blade Fury, so
if I get it wrong, my apologies. ;)

Post by ArtDent
I do have that up to about 4000 top damage I think, had to pump it to get
DS to shoot more times, but I find the BF to be 'easier' for me since I
keep it set up on the left button, all I have to do is press shift and I
can shoot them out, my spell hot keys for the right button are the 'F'
keys on top and it takes longer to move my hand to get to them (since my
left hand sits with fingers over shift/ctrl and alt for shooting/running
and 'looking').

I don't really get this. I also have Fire Blast, by default, on the left
mouse-button. Just press it on a (group of) monster(s), holding Shift when
necessary, and away it goes. I have the traps, Mind Blast, Shadow Mater
and BoS under the right mouse-button, and use F-keys and some other keys
to select that.

Post by ArtDent
Besides, with the knockback, I think it is 'safer', the
FB takes more time in the air, and is easier to miss,

The Knockback would be nice, but it looks to me that would also bump them
out of range of the Death Sentries I've placed, and put the monsters out
of reach of my Merc/Shadow Master.

Also, FB doesn't need AR to hit; it's a spell, so it always hits, and (if
the AS is to be believed) it has an area-of-effect, so you can hit more
than 1 monster at the same time.

I also think it's difficult to get more AR on a Trapper, since they don't
need any AR at all usually.

Post by ArtDent
I can 'machine gun'
the BF, almost seems to hit more often if I 'aim' in front of the monsters
and spray a bit, rather than 'highlighting' one and then another monster.

No experience with Blade Fury here, but this seems a bit weird, since BF
needs AR to hit.. You can 'spray' Frozen Orbs or instance, but in my
experience not AR-based attacks like throwing weapons, and probably also
Blady Fury. But as I said, I have no experience with it.

Post by ArtDent
And on top of all that, it is somehow just more 'satisifying' to my
twisted brain. :D

That's probably the most important reason of all to choose for using a
certain skill. ;)

Patrick.

[Patrick Vervoorn]

Post by Virtual Den

Post by Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Hmmm, I have quite a bit of experience with pure trappers and while

Bartuc's is a nice stop-gap, I'd rather use magical or rare claws with
either +2 assa or +3 traps and +x to certain traps mods, together with
IAS, and some stats.

I would too if I could spend enough time shopping but these weapons
which are so hard to shop, I mean with the extra useful mods.. Bartuc
is so easier to get and it is already fast but if he does not use Fire
Bomb the speed of the weapon is less important IMO for LS and DS even
if I like the way I can set up these traps faster..

I use the shopping method initially on NM Anya, to get some +3 traps and
+3 shadow claws. I also, when gambling, do not want to endlessly open and
close the shop window to get Coronets, so I also gamble all claws that are
being displayed. Got myself 2 claws with +2 assassin skills and +2 to
lightning sentry that way.

Post by Virtual Den

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Blade Fury, on the other hand, I have a bit less experience with, but I
thought this skill thrived off a healthy dose of Crushing Blow? None of
that is on Bartuc's...

I do not have experience with the BF skill but I considered it once,
when I saw someone using it because it looked so cool. I read in a
forum that this skill sucks so may be a good way to use it would be to
get some Crushing Blow as you suggested. Then you need to hit the
target so even if the Bartuc has a bonus to attack rating and with the
dex, would it be enough without the mastery, I think not. I would
rather think that BF could be a good one point skill if it was used
with some CB and a lot of Mastery.

I understood Blade Fury doesn't suck: it's actually a 1 point wonder, and
due to the mods that are passed to Blade Fury (Crushing Blow most notably)
a quite capable killer, apparently. Perhaps Google this group to find some
reports from the past...?

Post by Virtual Den

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Hmm, ok. Again, little experience with Blade Fury, but I'd perhaps be on
the lookout for a nice rare claw with +2 assa skills, loads of ed
(Cruel+Grandmaster's on it) and perhaps some +bonuses to useful skills.
Will be quite expensive though. ;)

OMG stop dreaming about the claw(s) needed!!! ;oP I have no xp in the
BF skill but I never considered using CB when I read this forum saying
this skill suck. Could BF be efficient with CB items even if they would
weaken the efficiency of the other traps but I think it can be very
playable .

Apparently it is.

Post by Virtual Den
One point in BF then boost the mastery and ........obviously the main
traps will be weaker but once there are two or three bodies, DS can
take care of them.I never boosted my attack rating with Dex but Two
Bartuc are not so bad afterall with 40 dex and the attack rating bonus.

Yes, that is perhaps a reason to do consider Bartuc's. However, how does
Blade Fury treat those two Bartuc's? Just like with a Barbarian, only the
mods on the weapon you swing with matter. So the +to ar on one weapon will
not boost the CtH on the other weapon. I suppose it's perhaps the same
with a dual-claw assassin?

Post by Virtual Den
I want to point out I replied to Patrick because he had many good
points but my replies are also pointed out to Artdent and some
precisions about the skills he is planning to use would be welcome. I
really think it could work and it would be great.!!! hey I ever saw two
or three of BF Asn.

They've been quite extensively described and documented in this newsgroup.

Regards,

Patrick.

[Bingain]

Post by Patrick Vervoorn

Post by Virtual Den

Post by Patrick Vervoorn
Blade Fury, on the other hand, I have a bit less experience with, but I
thought this skill thrived off a healthy dose of Crushing Blow? None of
that is on Bartuc's...

I do not have experience with the BF skill but I considered it once,
when I saw someone using it because it looked so cool. I read in a
forum that this skill sucks so may be a good way to use it would be to
get some Crushing Blow as you suggested. Then you need to hit the
target so even if the Bartuc has a bonus to attack rating and with the
dex, would it be enough without the mastery, I think not. I would
rather think that BF could be a good one point skill if it was used
with some CB and a lot of Mastery.

I understood Blade Fury doesn't suck: it's actually a 1 point wonder, and
due to the mods that are passed to Blade Fury (Crushing Blow most notably)
a quite capable killer, apparently. Perhaps Google this group to find some
reports from the past...?

I once made a Blade Fury Assy. Even with maxed claw mastery she
had problem hitting guys in Hell. If you can overcome the AR
issue, Blade Fury rocks because:

a) it carries elementary damages from any source (3/4);
b) it carries Crushing Blow and almost all other special mods;
c) it shoots at 6 frames irrespective of weapon speed. Thus, you
can carry a very slow weapon with huge damage and CB, and still
shoot as fast. The weapon also won't get worn out, so you can
carry a near-broken ethereal weapon without worry.

An assy carrying an ethereal Stone Crusher, while looks
extremely ugly and stupid, can dish out tons of damage in very
short time. Ghostflame will packs less raw damage and no CB, but
the added magic damage and ITD will also make it a great BF
weapon (I think this would be one of the best part-time BF
weapon). You can even use an ethereal Bonesnap if you don't mind
the look and don't need resists from shield/weapon.

I did not mention any claw as weapon, as claws either don't pack
enough damage, or don't have the killer mods. Even full Nat's
set is not a good BF setup.

In a nutshell, BF for an assy is like a range attacking version
of a CB_Zealot, so long as AR can be overcome.

Bing

[Shiflet]

I once made a Blade Fury Assy. Even with maxed claw mastery she had
problem hitting guys in Hell. If you can overcome the AR issue, Blade Fury

Fury runeword in an eth elite weapon is a nice BF weapon. It has ITD for
normal enemies, -25% enemy def and +20% AR for bosses and unique enemies,
plus 66% open wound, 33% deadly strike, 6% life leech, prevent heal...not to
mention the ED...as long as you have a reasonable amount of CB from other
sources(Guillame's and Gores/Goblins for example), they work quite well.

An assy carrying an ethereal Stone Crusher, while looks extremely ugly and
stupid, can dish out tons of damage in very short time. Ghostflame will
packs less raw damage and no CB, but the added magic damage and ITD will
also make it a great BF weapon (I think this would be one of the best
part-time BF weapon). You can even use an ethereal Bonesnap if you don't
mind the look and don't need resists from shield/weapon.

One problem with Bonesnap-2 handed weapons do NOT use their listed
damage...I believe the damage from a 2 handed weapon is halved(it's cut by
some percentage). While I don't recall the exact percentage, ultimately, you
wind up doing no more damage with a massive 2 hand weapon than you do with a
good one handed one, yet you lose the use of a shield/second claw. Two truly
great BF weapons are Stormlash and Fleshripper(ideally, eth versions), each
has high damage, and several deadly mods. Stormlash has 33% CB, and a 15%
chance of casting static field, which combined can bring monster health down
VERY fast. It also adds some lightning damage(1-473), allowing it some
effectiveness against PIs as well. Fleshripper is possibly even
deadlier...aside from it's own reasonable damage, it has 25% CB, 33% deadly
strike, a whopping 50% open wounds, PMH(redundant with OW, but still), slows
target by 20%, AND -50% target defense.

I did not mention any claw as weapon, as claws either don't pack enough
damage, or don't have the killer mods. Even full Nat's set is not a good
BF setup.

An eth elite Fury claw most certainly is a decent Fury weapon. An eth Chaos
elite claw isn't too bad either, it's at least as good as Ghostflame, which
you recommended...

Bing

[Bingain]

Post by Shiflet
Fury runeword in an eth elite weapon is a nice BF weapon. It has ITD for
normal enemies, -25% enemy def and +20% AR for bosses and unique enemies,
plus 66% open wound, 33% deadly strike, 6% life leech, prevent heal...not to
mention the ED...as long as you have a reasonable amount of CB from other
sources(Guillame's and Gores/Goblins for example), they work quite well.

Probably. My only Jah-equivalent runeword item was an Enigma
before I quit last year (thanks to massive rune-dupe). Other
than that, highest rune I ever had was a cubed Ber. And an elite
claw with good mods could be as expensive. Raw damage is
probably a little low though, for someone who can afford this
price tag. Of course if you can find an eth Scissors Suwayyah
with good mods.

Post by Shiflet
One problem with Bonesnap-2 handed weapons do NOT use their listed
damage...I believe the damage from a 2 handed weapon is halved(it's cut by
some percentage). While I don't recall the exact percentage, ultimately, you
wind up doing no more damage with a massive 2 hand weapon than you do with a
good one handed one, yet you lose the use of a shield/second claw. Two truly
great BF weapons are Stormlash and Fleshripper(ideally, eth versions), each
has high damage, and several deadly mods. Stormlash has 33% CB, and a 15%
chance of casting static field, which combined can bring monster health down
VERY fast. It also adds some lightning damage(1-473), allowing it some
effectiveness against PIs as well. Fleshripper is possibly even
deadlier...aside from it's own reasonable damage, it has 25% CB, 33% deadly
strike, a whopping 50% open wounds, PMH(redundant with OW, but still), slows
target by 20%, AND -50% target defense.

Yeah, these are nice.

Post by Shiflet

I did not mention any claw as weapon, as claws either don't pack enough
damage, or don't have the killer mods. Even full Nat's set is not a good
BF setup.

An eth elite Fury claw most certainly is a decent Fury weapon. An eth Chaos
elite claw isn't too bad either, it's at least as good as Ghostflame, which
you recommended...

Because Ghostflame can probably be acquired for p.gems, while a
part-time BF'er probably won't spend that much on a Fury/Chaos
unless his dad is an oil company executive.

Post by Shiflet

Bing

[ArtDent]

On 4-Sep-2006, Bingain <***@doYouYahoo.com> wrote:

Talking about Blade Fury...

Post by Bingain
The weapon also won't get worn out, so you can
carry a near-broken ethereal weapon without worry.

That is true.
However, if you use Blade Shield your weapon takes damage if it is 'used'.
So eth weapons aren't _necessarily_ the right choice.

[Shiflet]

Post by ArtDent
That is true.
However, if you use Blade Shield your weapon takes damage if it is 'used'.
So eth weapons aren't _necessarily_ the right choice.

Blade Shield is basically garbage though(the damage it deals is awful, it
doesn't transfer as many effects as BF, etc), so the right choice is
generally using an eth weapon and not using Blade Shield.

Post by ArtDent
--
If you woke up today...
Congrtaulations! You won!